Far 2 Fabulous

The Power of Personal Boundaries: Self-Care Reimagined

• Julie Clark & Catherine Chapman • Episode 22

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Have you ever wondered how setting boundaries could be the key to a balanced life? In today's episode, we welcome Mahnaz, the visionary behind Build With Boundaries. She shares her remarkable journey of managing a demanding career, caring for a chronically ill mother, and raising young children. Mahnaz underscores the transformative power of self-care and boundary-setting, revealing how these practices can reduce stress and create harmony in both personal and professional spheres. She challenges societal expectations and the guilt associated with taking time for oneself, urging us to prioritise our well-being.

Join us as we uncover the profound impact of boundaries on time management, communication, and overall well-being. By reimagining boundaries as tools—shields, clocks, voices, and pathways—we discover how they protect our time, energy, and aspirations. Mahnaz and I delve into the importance of identifying personal values and aligning our boundaries, ensuring a more intentional and fulfilling life. Through practical insights and personal anecdotes, we illustrate how busy moms can utilise boundaries to navigate their multifaceted roles more effectively.

In this empowering conversation, we introduce the boundary clock, a practical tool meticulously crafted to assist you in visually mapping out and prioritizing your boundaries. We advocate for moments of introspection in nature to gain clarity on personal needs and witness tangible progress. By zeroing in on what truly matters and stepping away from the constant pressure of societal expectations, you can foster your personal growth and safeguard your dreams. Tune in to explore how to embrace your uniqueness and redefine wellness with the art of setting boundaries.

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Julie:

Welcome to Far Two Fabulous hosted by Julie and.

Catherine:

Catherine, join us on a mission to embrace your fabulousness and redefine wellness. Get ready for some feistiness, inspiration, candid chats and humour as we journey together towards empowered wellbeing. Let's dive in, okay, hello, hello, everybody, and welcome back to this episode of Part 2. Fabulous, and we are feeling very, very fabulous today because we have got a fabulous guest with us. So the lead up to this conversation follows on from the one that we had with Helen last week and she started talking about boundaries, and that made me think of our very special guest today. I have only ever virtually met Manaz through our fantastic networking circles. I have had the pleasure of listening to one of her talks online and it was brilliant, so I'm really, really excited about everything that you are going to hear from her. So thank you for joining us, manaz. Tell us who you are, where you come from and how you got there.

Mahnaz:

Thank you so much for having me. It's lovely to be here. Thanks, julie and Catherine. Yes, we met in the networking circle. So, for those who don't know me, my name is Manaz, my business is called Build With Boundaries and that, therefore, that's why Catherine thought of me. My business has been set up through my own personal journey and I guess I am helping other mums in business just now with what I needed.

Mahnaz:

Many years ago, at one point in time I felt like the filling in a sandwich, surrounded by pressure young children, mother who was chronically ill and later diagnosed with cancer, and then I also helped to care for her to keep her at home, was working in the corporate world part-time as well. Husband was away quite a lot abroad. You know there were so many different pressures and you know we do not want to give up on any of our responsibilities, especially when they mean so much to us. So I wanted to be there for my mum, just as she has always, always been there for me, and I also had two young children under the age of 10, so you know they were school runs and all the rest. I'm sure everybody can imagine. And, having been there, what it helped me see was that we never really give ourselves that permission to ask ourselves what we want, who we are, what we want to do and what our purpose is, if you like, and something that you know what would fulfill us, both as mums and as business owners, because if you are a business owner, you can fall into this trap of overworking.

Mahnaz:

Yes, I've been there as well. No, no boundaries, and I've had to teach myself and get myself back to a better, you know, harmonious life where I can be doing both being a good mum and having a successful business at the same time, and that's what I help other mums do. I help them to manage their work and life so that they can be efficient in everything they do and be fully present and actually enjoying the peace and harmony that they have in their life, rather than feeling like they're just playing tug of war between all their priorities and going from one thing to the next and spinning all the plates and you know all the usual things that that you know come to mind and, especially visually. You know the mum's kind of running around doing everything and not necessarily even thinking about what they need, which is why I think this conversation is so important, because you know you're talking about well-being, wellness, and you know everything starts from within. If we don't look after ourselves, then you know that's such a great topic to talk about today.

Julie:

It sounds like you've got a magic wand there with how you just described that, and I'm feeling like I want that magic wand, because when you are doing all the things that you've just explained, how do you know if you haven't got boundaries in place? Because isn't that just part of normal life to be a busy mom, especially if you run your own business and you're looking after parents? Isn't that just things that you have to do and you can't get around that? How do we know whether we've got boundaries in place or not?

Mahnaz:

Well, I think this is the whole point, isn't it? We get used to the habits and patterns and routines that we have, and when we get used to them, we almost feel like there is no other way, because we can't see anything. It's foggy everywhere and we literally cannot see the path that we could go down. And that's why I think, sometimes, having that time, especially to yourself and in any shape or form, especially in those moments, it's so essential and critical for our own well-being, especially when we have a lot of things going on. And the more things we have going on, the more we need to focus. So that is, you know that self-care and whatever that word means to you, whatever that looks like, whether that's, you know, five minutes locked away in the bathroom, you know, know, different stages will give you different opportunities. But if you just feel that you do not have enough time for yourself, I think that is a very that's the beginning and that's the start, because why do we have to accept that that should be the way going forward?

Catherine:

yeah, that's definitely the the flag, isn't it the time, and I think, historically and society particularly to women, is that we are running around and if we're not, don't feel like we're seen to be running around like headless chickens. I think often there's that you know what are they doing? Maybe they're being lazy, maybe people think I'm being lazy. And we actually touched on that, on our self-care episode, which was like way back, it was like episode four or five.

Julie:

Yeah, definitely one of the early ones. We talked about feeling guilty if you're not doing something. Yeah, all the time, oh my goodness.

Mahnaz:

So, as mums, there's another layer, right, you know, as women, as mums, as business owners, everything and all the roles that we have a part to play in will add more pressure. And you're right. There is this mum guilt, and I talk a lot about mum guilt because mum guilt is about feeling guilty about the things that you are doing, and it's also about feeling guilty about the things you're not doing. And it's feeling a bit guilty about all of those things all at the same time?

Catherine:

Yeah, I mean there must be so many people listening to this, just nodding their heads. I mean, if you are nodding your head, you know that we've got a Facebook group. Come in and talk to us about it, because we'll be. We are, then, nodding, we are literally on this call, nodding with you.

Mahnaz:

Yeah, yeah absolutely, and I think whatever we do, we feel guilty about it and whatever we think we should do. And then there's all these. There's so many pressures and sometimes we don't realize a lot of those pressures can be internal as well. What I'm finding more and more I'm working with clients too is that they don't actually know who they are like, never mind like saying, oh, I would love a boundary that would help fix this thing. But hang on a minute, like who are you?

Mahnaz:

What do you need? What would make you? What would give you inner peace? Do you know this inner harmony? So it's not just about what's happening around us, because we have to start from within, and what I've found is through the work that I do. I've been bringing human design into my work as well, and it's been so powerful and so fascinating to see women recognizing themselves so like I have. I've got a lady who's just come out of my program and finished the program and for three months we've been working on her finding her sense of harmony, whatever that looks like to her.

Julie:

She's 63 years old and she said I didn't know who I was until I did the human design yeah, I think, like Catherine and I are big fans of human design, but there may be people listening that have no idea what you've just said, so I think I have to explain what that is absolutely so.

Mahnaz:

Human design is the line and the way that I like to explain it is. It's modern science meets spirituality. So it's this mixture between ancient and modern systems, so a mixture of astrology, chakra systems, kabbalah, the I Ching and quantum physics, to name a few. So it's piecing all these things together and what is based on is that when you are born and the place on earth where you're born, the energy around you and the planetary systems, everything dictates the gifts that you are born with. And you are born into this world with a design, and that design shows you where you can, how, how you can excel, because if you really lean into your strengths more and avoid the kind of other sides that don't come as life of ease, you know feeling fulfilled. So that's really what that does, and understanding that, and I didn't believe that it could work.

Mahnaz:

I didn't believe that this piece of paper, this chart that looks so complicated, could tell us anything more than like. How is that possible? Like, we all know about astrology and the sense of signs and the signs of the zodiac, but I've never really been one for them, but when I did this myself, and this was many, many years ago when I discovered it. That is through my own experience that I know how powerful it can be and you get to actually see who you are. You might understand elements of what your strengths are and there will be other areas that you actually did not realize and you did not fully acknowledge and the more and more that you can obviously accept, those embody them. You know who wants to spend more time on things that you're not so good at, when you can spend more time on the things that you enjoy come more naturally to you, easier for you, and then therefore, when you know what those are, you can start thinking about boundaries.

Catherine:

We've got a little bit of tangent on the topic, but you know boundaries come in because we have to know who we are and what we're wanting before we can say how, what boundaries would actually be helpful for us yeah, amazing, like play to basically play into your strengths, yeah, and perhaps it, yeah, signposts you to your strengths so that you can, you can utilize that in in what you do and then stop sort of slogging a dead horse on all the things that are not in your zone of genius or anything like that. That's like, yeah, it's just, it's incredible stuff. I've only very, very lightly skimmed it, but I that I can see it, see its worth in everything. I'm just. I wanted to just reflect back to what you were talking about.

Catherine:

We, when we were talking about time, we talk about lack of time as a real red flag to show that we haven't got any boundaries and that taking time. You said something about a few minutes in the bathroom and I just thought about Julie going and sitting and in the bathroom. You've often told me you just go when you need some time. You go and lock the door in the bathroom, sit on the side of the bath and and breathe yeah, or I do, or I do my tapping, yeah, yeah in the bathroom.

Julie:

When, when the kids were really young, the the bathroom was like that was my sanctuary Because it had a lock on the door, and it would be like, yeah, I need a few moments.

Catherine:

I'm going in the bathroom and millions of other moms, right, yeah, absolutely so. Having that taking that time for yourself, in wherever it is and however it looks, is so important and even deeper than that is that is the only time that you are going to be able to then start listening to yourself, to even know what you want. If you don't give yourself those moments of silence, there's never a chance to have that conversation, to know what you want. And I mean, for some people, maybe somebody's never ever asked them that.

Catherine:

And they've just just kind of bumbled through life. Not bumbled through life, because that feels like it takes like meaning away from it, but just continually roll through life like we do, without stopping and asking themselves that.

Mahnaz:

Well, we get onto this almost treadmill of doing and remember, you know, we are human, human beings, we need to be more. We're not human doings. And I think this is so powerful when we just have to keep reminding ourselves that we need to be more and when we are being more and, like you said, just quiet the noise, just like slowing down and getting into your body and whatever that looks like for you. You know, there are so many different ways and tools available to us and we just need to figure out what is that we need in the moment, and sometimes we are too busy to even ask ourselves what we need. Right. We need right, yeah, but when we do start doing that, it's going to have this compounding effect, because we can't suddenly become, um, you know, like if you were looking to run. You're not going to suddenly run a marathon. You're going to start with some smaller steps on, maybe perhaps daily, going out for x amount of steps, and then you're increasing them and going, and we have to start on this journey.

Mahnaz:

I think we're all very and me included very impatient, aren't we? We want everything now, yeah, and we have to understand that, being compassionate to ourself and saying, like we're here, we want to be here, we need to work towards that, not, oh, I have it now or I don't have it. It's what can happen and it's step by step taking that action, because without implementation, everything's just information or noise or knowledge. It doesn't mean anything and my top value is efficiency. So, for me, wasting time, wasting energy, wasting effort that is just like that is exactly what I help my clients to not do so they can be more efficient.

Mahnaz:

But when we are, then we are applying ourselves in a really more purposeful way and living a more intentional life, which is exactly where the boundaries fit in, because if we don't know what that means and what it looks like, we can't just create the boundary just like that, but understanding, I think, also what a boundary is, because I feel like the word gets a really bad rep like who wants boundaries right? Nobody said that ever. I would love to share a little perspective change on on the word boundaries and I can share with you four incredible ways that they can support you so that you can shift this thinking about, like you know, boundaries and feeling that resistance towards it, because it sounds quite restrictive, doesn't it?

Catherine:

Yeah, you're right.

Mahnaz:

Yeah, yeah. The way that I have described boundaries in the past is it feels like, if you're wanting boundaries, you either want to put yourself in a cage or you want to put someone else in a cage yeah, and that's who wants that? Like no one. So, instead, if we think about these four ways that they can help us, boundaries can be our shield so they can protect our time, our energy, our dreams, and when you are doing that, you are saying that your dreams matter and your well-being is a priority.

Mahnaz:

Boundaries can be your clock. They can help you to manage your time effectively. Boundaries can be your clock they can help you to manage your time effectively, so having you know limits on time and when and how you work, allowing you to be present, so, whether you are working or not being fully present, boundaries can be your voice, so they can communicate your needs and desires, because that's the reason that you're choosing them, and they can express what's important to you, and it's not about being selfish, it's about being being self-care for you. And then, lastly, boundaries can be your pathway, because they can create this um space for you so that you can achieve all the things that you want without compromising on any enjoyment yeah, that's really good.

Julie:

I love those four. Really makes you think about it in a different way, doesn't it? Yeah, you touched on values and and before we came on the chat, myself and katherine were having a cup of tea and we were talking about values linking to boundaries, and and we were looking at identity as well. Yes, yes, because, like you said, a lot of people don't know who they are. They don't necessarily know what their values are. So how do you help people pull those out and then connect that to their boundaries?

Mahnaz:

Yes, so that's really interesting. Values are something again similar to human design, but it's a slightly different way that I look at them and when, when people are working with me, I actually have a values expert who does one-to-one work with people to almost extract your core values and it's the words and the meaning that you have, because everybody's, you know, will interpret the same word differently and it's what is deeply personal, and she actually goes back to your life and picks them out. So it it's like you can see your values in you from a very young age, like they will be in your life story, and sometimes we need that help to draw them out because we don't really see them until we do that work and it's often quite difficult to do that for ourselves. So once you know what your values are and there's usually four or five values that will be very dominant and they will be very evident in times in your life where you have had really good times and you've had really bad times, and they will actually be evidence of them there and she's absolutely amazing at extracting this out.

Mahnaz:

So once you know what your values are, then you're in a better position to understand how you can then protect them because they mean something to you, which means if your values are triggered in general, you will on a daily basis or in your work or home, whatever situation you find yourself, and they will be when you react to things. They generally are things that have triggered your value and that is why there's this inner like you don't understand why, but you are like really getting worked up about something, or you're triggered, or it's like an environment or something somebody said because it will be connected to that. So when you can understand what your value is, then you can understand better how are things showing up and what can I do to make those situations better? And usually boundaries you know we can create boundaries around things that are meaningful to us because, again, thinking about that boundary as that shield and protection for us, um, you know, I think that's really helpful to see it in that visual way as well.

Catherine:

I love that. I love the visual about the shield, because it is so that the the negative kind of visual of the boundaries is that wall, but when you start to see it as as something that protects you, it takes on a whole different meaning, which is just absolutely beautiful, and I love that. For people that perhaps have not spent very much time thinking about who they are or what they want, then values is a really great place to start and it's like and I think often we we use the word value quite lightly, but I know that I've done value exercises that have taken a long, long time and we've gone really, really deep.

Julie:

So, yeah, it's a great place to start yeah, I love doing the values exercise as well. I've done that on myself and it did explain a lot. Like you said it, you go back through your life and you and you just think, right, that does that does make sense now, why I got so upset and why that caused a domino effect in a in a certain part of your life. Because you know, one of one of my values is loyalty, so that's come up a few times, you know when I've gone back over my life like whoa okay that explains that one yeah, and freedom is another one for me.

Julie:

So, yeah, there's been moments in the last few years where freedom has been really impacted and that's yeah, that's been a massive issue for me.

Catherine:

Understanding. Good to know that, though, isn't it? Even if you can't like in the last few years, even if you can't do anything about it, the fact that you know that freedom is your value and it's being stomped all over? You know why you're, why you cross.

Mahnaz:

I think it takes the pressure off.

Mahnaz:

Because it takes the pressure off what's happened in the past, because you might internally be feeling guilt or shame or a kind of blame inside for something that you can let go of.

Mahnaz:

And then, also, going forward, you start noticing things because then you know you're like well, freedom, loyalty, it makes sense, like it just making sense of things is like taking the lid off the pressure cooker and just saying do you know what?

Mahnaz:

You can just breathe and relax, you're okay and and you know when we, when I combine this values cause, it gives a different slant on who you are and you know what you're about and your human design. It gives you lots of different layers and every time you peel back another layer there's like something else and how do you make decisions and how can you react differently and how can you do things that are more aligned and you know, going round and round and round and just really so much self-development that it's not only about making sense of the past, it's how you act now, in the present. And then obviously, that is building that future for you where you're not triggered constantly because who wants that? And like really getting to accept yourself, because you know I don't say that lightly, because accepting ourself first we have to know who we are and secondly, like deeply accepting who you truly are, is actually a whole process and a whole journey in itself.

Catherine:

And it's so interesting that actually, when you're talking about all of this self-development stuff interesting that actually, when you're talking about all of this self-development stuff, the boundaries are almost just the icing on the, the cake. They're almost once you've peeled away these layers. I'm imagining that, putting boundaries in, I imagine your clients go. Well, of course I'm going to do that. Of course I'm going to do that it makes sense, it makes better sense.

Mahnaz:

But if you said to somebody to begin with, at the start, like you need to do this, like there is this resistance again, like why do I want to put up a wall? And oh, but I can't, oh no, but what will they think? Oh no, but I need to help them. You know we're, we're overgiving and you I think we talked about like people pleasing and all these I mean these are the things. We're overextending ourselves, those are the things that will happen. And if we don't understand how or what we need to protect, then you know boundaries are far away, like they just become the next step and in this whole journey, and you know, for us to get there, we need to be comfortable.

Mahnaz:

The whole thing with boundaries is we can't just say we'll create this boundary, we have to really want it, because you could communicate it and say I want this boundary, I'm going to stop work at four o'clock every day. But if you really don't mean it and there's no intention behind it, it's never going to happen. And then, when your child walks through the door or your friend calls, or you know someone's at the door and you go away for half an hour during your work and your you know your boundaries are all over the place in terms of when you're working or when you're not. You're going to allow that to happen if you didn't actually feel that was a boundary that was needed. So either you will walk over them or someone else will.

Catherine:

Yeah, that's so true, yeah. You talked that's so true. Yeah, you talked about time earlier on. Now, for me, time is. I use it as an excuse and I know that that's not right.

Mahnaz:

I know that that's not right.

Catherine:

It's a real problem for me, definitely, and I know that I am not alone and it's also so. It's always the excuse I'm going to go there and I'm that. I am know that I am not alone and it's also so. It's always the excuse I'm going. I'm going to go there and I'm going to use the word for why people don't. It's really obvious answer why people don't exercise they don't have time. Of course, you must see that, and I think that the what you've talked about with the values actually really supports this. But what are the? What are good things that people can do? Uh, with regards to boundaries for things like time, well, you've touched on a great point.

Mahnaz:

I mean, like when we don't want to do something, we can use time as that excuse are you telling me that people don't want to exercise?

Catherine:

I don't know what you're talking.

Julie:

I don't understand those words it's not, it's not a priority for them. That's the thing, isn't it?

Mahnaz:

exactly Julie. This is exactly what I was going to say in their mind. Of course, they want the results from what you're saying they need to do, but are they? They need to commit the time right and they need to commit the time they need to say that it's a priority. If they don't say it's a priority when something is a priority, you will make time, like we all make time. If the school phoned us now and told us our child is sick, are we going to say, oh no, I won't bother picking them up today, I'll leave them for an hour or are we going to make time to go and do it? You know we can create our own priorities and we do have that internal power to do that whether we give ourselves permission to do it is another thing?

Julie:

oh, that's another whole topic, isn't it giving yourself permission?

Catherine:

whoa, yeah, that's a big one.

Julie:

I must just tell you a story quickly about this time thing, because this will make you laugh and you'll be able to relate to it. So a few years ago I was in a group coaching program sure, sure, I've told you this before, catherine and one of the exercises we have to do around this time thing was we had to do nothing for four hours. And at the time this triggered me massively, to the point where in the we're on a Zoom in the group coaching program, I said to the person who wasn't a parent I said you have no idea, I cannot do nothing for four hours, and I totally threw the toys out the pram. And so the the coach, who was very good, he just listened to me have a rant, and then afterwards he said so everyone in the room, four hours of doing nothing, except for Julie who needs to do six.

Julie:

Oh, my goodness, yeah, and it really taught me a lesson, because it made me think about things in a different way. I did do the four hours. It was amazing because I hadn't. I couldn't remember the last time that I'd done nothing. Yeah, but even an hour, let alone four, and initially I had all the voices in my head going what a waste of time. What are you doing? You're a loser. You know all these things that come up when you sit by yourself for a while.

Mahnaz:

Yeah, it was amazing. Yeah, we get caught in this trap of busyness, but the thing is, sometimes the best thing we can do for being the most productive is to actually pause and do nothing. Yeah, like we. Just again it comes back to that permission. Are we going to give ourselves permission to give it a try? It's hard, nothing comes. But when does anything good come from something really easy?

Catherine:

and it's. It talks to your value of efficiency, doesn't it? I know, when I'm I'm sat at my desk basically getting nowhere fast because I'm tired or because I'm hungry, or even because I I need to go to the toilet or something and I've not, and I'm like no, I don't have time to do this. And then you finally give yourself permission to go and have a nap for 10 minutes, go and have a sit in the sun for 10 minutes, go to the toilet and then, when you come back, you're so much more efficient and you probably, if you'd have done that absolutely, you know, half an hour ago, you'd have got all your jobs done yeah, absolutely.

Mahnaz:

But we can't see it. Sometimes we just can't see ourselves no amazing.

Catherine:

So obviously our audience are. We focus on well-being, and when I wrote the email to you and when we were talking about this, I was really struck actually with how we, how we can't have good fitness, good health, good well-being without boundaries. It's, it's actually impossible. So have you got any top top tips for us?

Mahnaz:

well, I think this whole changing your perspective about the boundaries is really key, because, before you do anything like, if you don't actually desire to have better boundaries, you're never, ever going to get anybody's. This resistance and and what we, what we resist will persist always and and I think that is a key, key element. What I can, what I can share, is I think it's important to work out what is needed for you. So I wish I could give you like a tip to go away and do something magical, but I think formulas don't really work in that way. But what I can offer is I have a free worksheet called the boundary clock and I've created a visual worksheet that you can literally print off and take away. Like go into nature, and I encourage you to do that.

Mahnaz:

Go away and actually do the worksheet to see where are your boundaries.

Mahnaz:

Like visually, you can see them and once you see them, you can't unsee them right.

Mahnaz:

And secondly, you can actually look at which one is the weakest, which one is the one that you need to work on the most, because it's all very well trying to work on boundaries, but they will look very different for everyone and I think, again, coming at it from that again, that efficiency point of view, like it makes sense to work on the thing that is causing you the most or would impact you the most, if that makes sense.

Mahnaz:

So which one is that? Like we need to work that out and I can't tell everybody what that is and nor should anyone, and I think doing this exercise would be really helpful. And again, doing it visually, I think it just makes it so much easier to like put things out and when people do it and they draw this on the clock, they actually see like we don't get those moments to go away and do anything. So obviously that's my gift to take this free boundary clock worksheet and just do your work to figure out, like, what does your boundary clock look like? And then you will be able to start going down. Like we talked about this-by-step process, because you can't do everything at once, so you have to pick an area like what's most important for you and this, this clock, will help you to.

Catherine:

To identify that it's really good. I've done it and and, as with so many things, it's never the thing that you think of when you're, when you're visually then looking at it, there's the smaller kind of segment of it is is never the thing that you think of, and so, and then it makes it very efficient starting from that, from that point, and kind of working outwards oh fantastic.

Mahnaz:

I'm glad you did it.

Julie:

Yeah, no, it's really what was the area that you needed to work on. Can you remember? I can't remember now.

Catherine:

And I got my colouring pens out and everything I had a lovely time.

Julie:

Oh well, that's good. I love doing those visual things. I remember years ago I went to do a mood board. You know, a visual. What is it called? A mood board? No, what's it called? Yeah, is that right? Or vision board, vision board, that's it. I went to a workshop to do a vision board, which was supposed to be a business workshop, and when I stepped back from the day and I got all my pictures on, I realized it was a personal one and I needed to move house. And that's when I moved to Whitstable.

Julie:

Yeah, it was so obvious, like in front of me, I thought I'd gone for some business stuff.

Catherine:

Yeah, so cool that's so nice, it's lovely, though it isn't, like you suggested, going out into nature or something. It's taking yourself out of that usual situation and just getting lost, and that's when your intuition kicks in, isn't it?

Mahnaz:

and you give it that space and that opportunity to to speak absolutely yeah, quieten all the voices and just like, have a moment, like that's literally you. We can all gift ourselves that moment. Again, it's just prioritizing it, you know, making sure that if it is important for you that you need to make it happen. And, yeah, I think, just having that insight on where you are you can't unsee it afterwards so that's what's incredibly powerful and you can go back and repeat it and do the exercise obviously again and see where you are maybe in six months time or something, isn't it always good?

Catherine:

yeah, we have to see that, see that progress and it is. It's just about having to keep, because I mean we have got, we have got histories and lifetimes of telling us to be busy and and double busy and all this sort of stuff and it's reminding ourselves that actually that isn't the most efficient way and that and that taking up this time for ourselves makes us far more efficient and the biggest word that we need to just delete from our whole dictionary is should, should yes, yes, we don't have that word, do we?

Catherine:

no more shooting for ourselves.

Mahnaz:

No, exactly no shooting, because if we get, if we just start noticing that and understanding that there's a big difference between should and that inner, you know what I want and just going inside and and, like you said, taking that moment and and giving ourselves that space so that we can bring the answers to the surface it's like they're just so deep down that might take us a little bit more time to help them, encourage them to come to the surface makes me think of that soul beverly night.

Julie:

One shoulda woulda. Coulda means I'm out of time.

Catherine:

Yeah, there you go, ah he knew clearly we did that at choir, didn't?

Julie:

we? Yeah, I think we did. Yeah, I left that as an earworm now all day.

Catherine:

Yeah, no, definitely my, just my last parting visual, as you were talking then, because you were talking about boundaries being a shield for us. But actually when we know what we want, if we've done our vision board or we've chosen something through our time wheel or something like that, that the boundaries are actually something that protects that, that vision for us, that want whatever, that desire for us, we get to dreams.

Mahnaz:

Yeah, it's like that dream it's like you know having. Imagine having a little um glass bowl and having a little mini little tree in there and you're nurturing it, you're giving it life, you're helping it grow, you're giving it all the things it needs, but you have that protection element yeah, because you would do.

Catherine:

I mean, we do that for our kids, don't we? We are absolutely a barrier and boundary for our kids all the way around, and we would. We would fight anything off to make sure that they were safe and that they fulfilled their full potential.

Mahnaz:

Yet, funny enough, we never put ourselves there yeah, we would do that for their dreams, so why not our own? That's a great question to ask. Especially as mums, we can connect with that so well. But we do not need to be at the bottom of the list, and we definitely shouldn't be. Because we are, we serve ourselves better and we look after ourselves better and we look after others better, then, yeah, absolutely. It just goes all in circles and you, you know we're giving our people more nurturing and able to do that yeah, so it's never selfish no, it's, yeah, it's totally necessary and we get to.

Catherine:

One of my big things is that we get to then be a shining light for for other women, for our daughters, for our children. Yes, um of of how it, I was going to say how it should be done.

Mahnaz:

Yeah, well, we are.

Mahnaz:

We are being role models, we're being role models at the end of the day they can see, they're going to learn more by seeing than us telling, and and so let's show them let's like show them what that means, because I think, like I have two boys so yeah, I don't, I don't have a daughter to show how to create better boundaries, because I think women do have this much harder time than boys.

Mahnaz:

But my boys understand what boundaries mean and what it's like to have a mum who does have boundaries. And you know, everybody needs to learn and know about this, and I think we're just shaping the next generation and helping them to see and have examples and evidence to showcase how they can play out in reality, not in like theoretical you should do this or this can't. This is an option and this is an option. It's like, well, actually my mum used to do this, or my mum does this that those are great memories to have for them to be able to tackle whatever comes their way in their future yeah, it's a great lesson also to learn to not stomp on other people's boundaries, to really respect other people's boundaries.

Catherine:

so, yes, if you are showing the boys that these are my boundaries and they're not to be crossed, that's how they go out into life and I think often people will. Well, people will push your boundaries, as do the children, but if they yeah, if they've been taught to respect boundaries, that's invaluable actually, especially out in modern life now.

Julie:

Yeah, absolutely in modern life now. Yeah, absolutely, Absolutely especially now.

Catherine:

Love that, I love that so much. Thank you so so much. I knew that this was going to be magical.

Julie:

I didn't really know where it was going to go, as most of our conversations we never do, do we?

Mahnaz:

That's the magic of kind of coming on a podcast just having conversations that are real. So yeah, appreciate it yeah, thank you.

Catherine:

It's brilliant, so good. We will put your link to your free gift in our show notes and we will also. I know I keep banging on about it, but I want to carry on the conversation. I enjoy it so much. So we'll also put the link into our Facebook group and I'm sure that Manas will come in there, and so, if we've got any other questions, I'm sure she'd be happy to chat with you there.

Mahnaz:

Tag me and then I'll get a notification for sure. And the Boundary Clock worksheet. There's an easy link.

Catherine:

I've created Buildwithboundariescom slash clock oh link. I've created buildwithboundariescom. Slash clock oh easy nice.

Mahnaz:

Thank you, it's good to make it easy.

Catherine:

Thank you so much. Thank you so much. Bye, bye, bye. Thank you for keeping us company today.

Julie:

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Catherine:

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Julie:

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